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| Zardnaar |
 Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 9:28 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 27 Jun 2008
Posts: 4
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We played 4t ed in the weekend and from the DM POV I loved it. I took me about an hour to draw a map, 2 hours to stock it and about 50 minutes to generate 2 PCs for my players who were on their way.
The PCs got through 8 encounters or so in 6-7 hours of gameplay. In 3.5 it was often 1-3 maybe 4. Everyone had fun. 1 player liked it with reservations however. He liked it but said the mechanics seemed all about dealing damage in various ways and all classes essentially being varients. |
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| terraleon |
| Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 8:33 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 16 Jan 2008
Posts: 2032
Location: upstate NY
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I think the problem right now is that 4E provides tools that easily meet the needs of a very specific playstyle and that if you play in a game that mainly utilizes that style, you're very happy. If you ran games that heavily or even partially utilized the material that was omitted from these core books, then you find yourself saying, "there just aren't the tools here to play the games and tell the stories I want to tell." That can be a little off-putting, as if WotC said, "Your stories are less valid than the stories we think you should be playing. If you want, you can wait a few months and we should have something for you...should...please wait..."
That will be where 4E has it's chance to shine or sink-- foremost through the adventures they provide and then through the supplements. If those products are quality and meet the demands of the players, then I think 4E will fly. If those products are sub-par, I sense a _Skills&Powers_ edition. For me, right now, I have to say the tools aren't there, and 4E isn't really even treading water.
-Ben.
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progressio sine timore aut praejudica - Spectemur agendo |
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| EL |
| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 9:30 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 27 May 2008
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| Zardnaar wrote: |
| He liked it but said the mechanics seemed all about dealing damage in various ways and all classes essentially being varients. |
That is a very common opinion. Everything about the classes comes off as window dressing since everyone is now on the same playing field. It is one of my big problems with 4E as well.
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3E+PF=KQ subscription IMHO |
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| Wembily |
| Posted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 3:00 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 12 Aug 2008
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Location: Dallas, Texas
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I've also been playing since 1E and there are some pros and cons to 4E. Since all the changes my favorite is still 2E, but no one that I know plays that. After now playing about eight 4E games this is what I summerize.
Pros
1) If you like Video games you'll love this with the powers.
2) Warlord is a pretty neat class. Like a Skald- warrior/bard
Cons
1) If you don't like to mix World of Warcraft and D&D you'll hate this. As a joke I lay out my cards like keyboard buttons and press the card when I do a power and use terms like "brb" and such.
2) Tiefling is a core race.
3) Gnome is now a monster.
4) Skill Challenges seemed like a good idea, but vastly borring.
5) Game focuses completely on killin' and little to no RP.
6) No trade skills
7) Less and less rules
8.) Stupid hard to die.
9) Wizards no longer have familiars
10) Rangers no longer have pets.
11) Rangers are now duel-wielding swashbucklers
12) Barbarians, monks and druids don't come out for another year.
13) The whole game revolves around mini's and movement.
14) It's made like a MMO where you now have DPS, Tank ect.
So, this is what I see 5th edition will be:
1) Two Stats: physical and Mental
2) Two Saves: Phsyical and magic
3) You will get 100 Hp per level.
4) Diceless or paperless
5) Only six magic items
6) All rules can be condensed into a 3x5 notecard.
7) The Terrasque will be a playable race ( ) |
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| varianor |
| Posted: Sun Aug 17, 2008 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 06 Jan 2008
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| all right, I've now played it once. It's an interesting game system. We perhaps played at a little bit of a higher level than one would want to start with (L5). I definitely want to try it 1-2 more times before forming a complete opinion. That said, it has a lot of mechanical savvy and good organization of the individual powers. Crappy index though. |
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| Wolfgang |
| Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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Kobold Overlord
Joined: 30 Dec 2007
Posts: 5008
Location: The Mines
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There's a fan-created index that is miles ahead of the official one.
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Publisher, Kobold Press |
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| kunger00 |
| Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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Location: central Texas
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| Wembily wrote: |
Cons
1) If you don't like to mix World of Warcraft and D&D you'll hate this. As a joke I lay out my cards like keyboard buttons and press the card when I do a power and use terms like "brb" and such.
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I'll throw my two coppers into the can and say my bit as well I suppose...
Wembily hit it right on the head for me in his statement above...
I suppose I'm now an old grognard and the young wippersnappers are all ready for change...
But, honestly... I'm tired.
I've got shelves and shelves full of D&D books (sadly, lost most of my 1E stuff in a basement flood years ago) and a lot of it is 3x... stuff that I never had a chance to use. (I shudder when I think what that says about me...)
Now, let me point out that I only bought the 4E PHB (I wasn't going to shell out even MORE $ for something sight unseen...) and, as a game, it isn't bad.
If someone said "Hey, let's try this new roleplaying game called 'MMO Land' I would say, 'Hey, this isn't to bad... but I prefer D&D'"
However, This is being sold as D&D... which I have a hard time swallowing. This, to me at least, feels like a different game... One, as many have stated, is like a pen and paper version of an MMO... or, better yet, MMO/Board game/skirmish level war game...
To me... Pathfinder feels more like what 4E *SHOULD* have felt like.
As another poster pointed out, I'm sure that SOME of the Pathfinder download popularity is, in fact, because it is free. But I honestly LIKE what Bulmahn is doing...
I got my Pathfinder RPG Beta at the FLGS today and looked at it even more closely than I did the PDF... and I can say for sure that my next game (which starts in 2 weeks) will be Pathfinder rules set in Ptolus (with smatterings of Zobeck thrown in...  )
However, at the same time I picked up Pathfinder I also picked up the new 4E Forgotten Realms... after two hours of reading... I can honestly say I'm even more disappointed in the new 4E... not because I'm some rabid fan of Forgotten Realms and I feel they messed up "my realms" but because, in my opinion, the layout of the book is total hooey... FR 4E costs $15 more than Pathfinder RPG (and it can't even be used alone, it has to be used with the FR Players guide!) and has 100 pages less...
No thanks.
Pathfinder RPG for me please! In fact... I can use the Pathfinder RPG to run my 3.x stuff that I have never used!
(sorry if this post rambles... it's a bad habit of mine) |
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| Jaye |
| Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 8:27 am Post subject: I've had a look at 4e... |
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Joined: 18 Apr 2008
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...and so far, it just doesn't look like the game for me.
And that makes me sad.
Fortunately, Pathfinder makes me happy. As someone said above, it's what 4e should have been. |
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| farewell2kings |
| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 5:56 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 28 Feb 2008
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| No 4e for me. My players are die-hard 3.5 players, even though they went to a 4e demo at the local game store a few weeks ago. They said they had fun with the 4e adventure being run, but it wasn't any faster or any more "entertaining" than 3.5 to them. So, we're staying with 3.5 which makes me even more glad that KQ was started. |
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| Koldoon |
| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 4:04 pm Post subject: 4e and 3.5 |
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Joined: 06 Apr 2008
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I have had a chance to play some 4e, and I have to say, I enjoy it. I enjoy 3.5 too. I wish this whole debate hadn't escalated as it has in so many different forums.
I hear a lot of criticisms of 4e that amount to people not liking any change, even if it might be good. I hear lots of criticisms of 4e that suggest that there is no role playing involved. That's crap, frankly.
Now, the 4e camp isn't fair in how it talks about 3.5 either... but then some of the criticisms they give of 3.5 are justified... and I say that as someone who enjoys the game.
3.5 does take too long to prep for as a DM. It is a pain to play encounters at high levels.
I don't like everything about 4e, I don't like everything about 3.5 - and I'm not crazy about everything in Pathfinder either. All of them have good points, and I expect that I will enjoy all of them.
I'm playing a 4e game now, and rather enjoying it. I don't find the amount of roleplaying any less for my players than they had in 3.5, and there's a lot about the system I really like.
Feh. This is almost as bad as getting into a political debate. Not trying to get anyone hot under the color... I'm just frustrated at all the edition wars.
I'm just glad KQ is around so that I don't need to choose between editions, at least not yet.
- Ashavan |
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| The Jade |
| Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 11:25 am Post subject: Re: 4e and 3.5 |
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Joined: 31 Dec 2007
Posts: 59
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| Koldoon wrote: |
Feh. This is almost as bad as getting into a political debate. Not trying to get anyone hot under the color... I'm just frustrated at all the edition wars.
- Ashavan |
Inexplicably, I find myself actually feeling hot under the collar. I'm not upset, just feeling the sensation of heat. Am I experiencing male menopause or something?
Please refrain, in future, from accidentally programming my body with your words. I'm still trying to forgive you for that 'break a leg' blunder. |
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| Hal Maclean |
| Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 9:56 am Post subject: |
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I've run a few 4e games and, from a role playing perspective, found that the same principle applies to it as every other RPG.
You get back what you put into it.
Those who make an effort to create interesting characters tend to end up with interesting characters. Those who don't bother get a bunch of numbers.
Combat seems easier. The turns are quicker meaning people get to do more dice rolling. That's good or bad depending upon how you approach it.
I do miss charm person though... |
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| The Jade |
| Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:28 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 31 Dec 2007
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| Hal Maclean wrote: |
| I do miss charm person though... |
High-fantasy ruffies sez me! |
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| hitchcock |
| Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 4:32 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 18 May 2008
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| Hal Maclean wrote: |
You get back what you put into it.
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Agreed!
However, I seems to require I put a lot more into it than the previous edition. In fact, I seem to be putting a lot of the the previous edition back into it so I can pretend its still Dungeons & Dragons. |
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| Hal Maclean |
| Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 4:39 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 09 Jan 2008
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| The Jade wrote: |
| Hal Maclean wrote: |
| I do miss charm person though... |
High-fantasy ruffies sez me! |
You say the same thing about gin... |
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